Adventure Bike Rider Forum

Crossrutted wrote:

johnnyboxer wrote: ↑Wed Jan 27, 2021 6:56 pm

Crossrutted wrote:

daveuprite wrote: ↑Tue Jan 26, 2021 4:30 pm Here we go again... It's 220 kgs for god's sake! It's a single cylinder 650! Why on earth is it anything over 160kgs? That's like going everywhere with two sacks of cement on board, but nothing to build.

The Suzuki DR650 was 150kgs 30 years ago !

The current Yamaha T700 is lighter than this KLR and it's a 700cc TWIN !

I'll just leave this here... AJP PR7 - comes with all you need. 155Kgs.

But not many are buying them

For every PR7 Sold, I bet Yamaha are selling 25-30 T7’s as they appeal to more punters as a solid dual purpose bike that they can ride off-road and tour on

JB you're probably correct -so what?

You can tour on anything - look at Godspeed for example. Solid? Exactly, equals overweight.

My point is - mid range off-roading singles are a bit niche

CCM and AJP have/are trying it

690/701 are more rounded & have to be modded for more serious off-road (as does the T700)

People seem to be drifting away from 600-700cc singles and towards lighter 700-800cc Twins, like the T7 and 790R as they seem to provide better fun/ability on the road to get to the trails and then are half decent on everything off-road (except extreme single track stuff) and this is what a lot of Adv Riders seem to want nowadays

People (as they get older are drifting down from the litre class Adv Bikes) to these twins and maybe a smaller 250/350 enduro or trail bikes for the really nadgery stuff

The way I see it is, if you want the choice to hang a load of luggage, and possibly a pillion, then most bikes come in at 200kg ish, minimum. If you've just got single foot pegs, then your on or around 150kg. Maybe it's the beefed up sub frame, frame, etc, thats needed to take the extra weight? I think, do your research as to what ya want, needs, and ya pays ya money

Oops, forgot to say, like the look of the KLR.

johnnyboxer wrote: ↑Thu Jan 28, 2021 3:00 pm
My point is - mid range off-roading singles are a bit niche

CCM and AJP have/are trying it

690/701 are more rounded & have to be modded for more serious off-road (as does the T700)

JB There is a massive difference between the CCM and PR7.

The CCM engine is far smaller (450cc) and more highly stressed than the PR7.

The PR7 is closer to the 690/701 package. IMO the only area the 690/701 beats the PR7 is the latest 690/701 engine.

The PR7 has far better ergos and arguably better suspension (out of the box - most have experienced the KTM "ready to race" set -up )

None of the twins are capable of "serious off road" in the hands of an average rider. (Waits for posts from the "I've taken my GS up Everest" crowd.

The only twin I've ridden/owned capable of serious off road was the late, lamented Aprilia RXV. The KTM LC8 bikes are great in open going but in the tight they are very hard work.
The other pretenders are just hospital visits waiting to happen.

I agree that the "adventure" market place is constantly changing, but the move to mid range twins is a triumph of marketing over function, combined with massive optimism on the part of the prospective owner.

It is a pity they didn't fit the Versys 650 twin engine in there, guys in the States have already done it many times. It would have not changed the weight too much and made a great travel bike.

Bart1 wrote: ↑Fri Jan 29, 2021 4:32 pm It is a pity they didn't fit the Versys 650 twin engine in there, guys in the States have already done it many times. It would have not changed the weight too much and made a great travel bike.

We've both been there with the mk1 versys eh Bart, 8 or 9 years ago

Approx 180kg, Peak District October 2011 with the standard front end on and 17" slippy slidey Distanzias Bart's was modified with a DRZ front end which I too bought but sold the bike before fitting

[/quote]

I agree that the "adventure" market place is constantly changing, but the move to mid range twins is a triumph of marketing over function, combined with massive optimism on the part of the prospective owner.
[/quote]

I’m sorry but I disagree. I know lots of large adventure bike owners and all of them have a realistic view of the bikes and their capabilities. Three of them are able to ride their bikes on very technical terrain but they don’t use them for rally racing - they have specials for that.
From my personal experience only (so not a scientific study) the popularity of adventure bikes is down to rider demographics ie we’re all getting older. So we have more time on our hands and disposable income to go touring but we want to be comfortable.
I used to be able to roughly divide all my biker friends into 3 categories
Race
Harley/chop
Giant trallie
Now they all ride big adventure bikes - some have a classic or Harley as well and some have little trail bikes.

The advertisers can use all the professional motocross riders they like - nobody, I know, believes it and they don’t care either.

I believe the move away from middle weight singles to twins was down to emissions. Hopefully the manufacturers will overcome that - I do like a 650 single

Crossrutted wrote:

johnnyboxer wrote: ↑Thu Jan 28, 2021 3:00 pm
My point is - mid range off-roading singles are a bit niche

CCM and AJP have/are trying it

690/701 are more rounded & have to be modded for more serious off-road (as does the T700)

JB There is a massive difference between the CCM and PR7.

The CCM engine is far smaller (450cc) and more highly stressed than the PR7.

The PR7 is closer to the 690/701 package. IMO the only area the 690/701 beats the PR7 is the latest 690/701 engine.

The PR7 has far better ergos and arguably better suspension (out of the box - most have experienced the KTM "ready to race" set -up )

None of the twins are capable of "serious off road" in the hands of an average rider. (Waits for posts from the "I've taken my GS up Everest" crowd.

The only twin I've ridden/owned capable of serious off road was the late, lamented Aprilia RXV. The KTM LC8 bikes are great in open going but in the tight they are very hard work.
The other pretenders are just hospital visits waiting to happen.

I agree that the "adventure" market place is constantly changing, but the move to mid range twins is a triumph of marketing over function, combined with massive optimism on the part of the prospective owner.

I was impressed with I had a lot ok and sit on the PR7 at the NEC in November 2019

Well put together

How much are they?

Re. the SWM 650 (It's a 600 really), here's a brand new one for a good price if any one on here is on the look out:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/S-W-M-Superd ... SwHhlgD~Zd

That's a lot of brand new bike for the money. The engine's well proven, it weight 170kgs and it's well equipped. Those great big panniers would have to go if it was mine, but what a good package for long distance dirt work.

Good find that Dave....go on you know you want to