I am lucky enough to have ethanol free petrol from a small collection of filling stations owned by an independent garage. They told me the ethanol is only added as the tankers leave the refinery as it is such a problem.
My 4.5 litre V8 TVR had to run on Super and loved Shell V Max, was ok-ish on the overpriced and overrated BP Super but ran like a bag of nails on Tesco 99. Mostly used the local Esso Super and had no problems.
I have started putting Super in the Street Twin.
Petrol: supermarket vs shell etc
- Scott_rider
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Re: Petrol: supermarket vs shell etc
Here's a maths question:
If the better fuel gives an extra 10% range, as some have said, how much cheaper does the poorer fuel have to be to still make it worth buying?
So just looking at it financially and not from the performance point of view.
This sort of O'level maths makes my head spin...
If the better fuel gives an extra 10% range, as some have said, how much cheaper does the poorer fuel have to be to still make it worth buying?
So just looking at it financially and not from the performance point of view.
This sort of O'level maths makes my head spin...
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Re: Petrol: supermarket vs shell etc
I’d pay and do pay the extra just for my own peace of mind knowing that surely the engine is benefiting from the better grade fuelScott_rider wrote:Here's a maths question:
If the better fuel gives an extra 10% range, as some have said, how much cheaper does the poorer fuel have to be to still make it worth buying?
So just looking at it financially and not from the performance point of view.
This sort of O'level maths makes my head spin...
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Re: Petrol: supermarket vs shell etc
It's not just the fuel saving when you go over to diesel engines... Blocked egr valves and dpf cost big money.... All because the combustion cycle is full of shit adatives..
Would you buy beer with packing adatives!.. Think of it as palm oil from the food industry..
I like my fuel pure
Would you buy beer with packing adatives!.. Think of it as palm oil from the food industry..
I like my fuel pure
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Re: Petrol: supermarket vs shell etc
The price difference is much more than it used to be so, I think, more of a running benefit than cost improvement.Scott_rider wrote: ↑Wed Dec 18, 2019 5:50 pm Here's a maths question:
If the better fuel gives an extra 10% range, as some have said, how much cheaper does the poorer fuel have to be to still make it worth buying?
So just looking at it financially and not from the performance point of view.
This sort of O'level maths makes my head spin...
My TVR had to run on Super and some modern sports cars need higher octane fuel.
2023 Husqvarna Norden 901
2014 KTM 690 ENDURO R
2014 KTM 690 ENDURO R
Re: Petrol: supermarket vs shell etc
I think the easy way to calculate it is to work out the percentage improvement in mpg versus the percentage price rise. This way is does not matter if you work out the price in litres or gallons.
Eg. My Himmy does roughly 80mpg on Sainsbury’s unleaded and 85mpg on their super unleaded. So 85/80 = 1.0625 times 100 gives 106.25% or an increase of 6.25%
At the moment the unleaded is £1.21 per litre and the super is £1.28. So 1.28/1.21 = 1.0579 times 100 gives 105.79% or a price increase of 5.79%.
Therefore for my bike at the moment the difference is negligible but I am slightly better off using the super unleaded in financial terms and over my annual mileage last year of about 12,000 it has a greater impact. As it gives me better running it is worth doing. In France a few years ago the difference in price was often a couple of cents so definitely worth doing.
As the cost of fuel rises, if the difference In cost stays the same, the percentage difference decreases.
I think I have got that right, I’m off for a pint with all the money I have saved.
Cheers Jak
Eg. My Himmy does roughly 80mpg on Sainsbury’s unleaded and 85mpg on their super unleaded. So 85/80 = 1.0625 times 100 gives 106.25% or an increase of 6.25%
At the moment the unleaded is £1.21 per litre and the super is £1.28. So 1.28/1.21 = 1.0579 times 100 gives 105.79% or a price increase of 5.79%.
Therefore for my bike at the moment the difference is negligible but I am slightly better off using the super unleaded in financial terms and over my annual mileage last year of about 12,000 it has a greater impact. As it gives me better running it is worth doing. In France a few years ago the difference in price was often a couple of cents so definitely worth doing.
As the cost of fuel rises, if the difference In cost stays the same, the percentage difference decreases.
I think I have got that right, I’m off for a pint with all the money I have saved.
Cheers Jak
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Re: Petrol: supermarket vs shell etc
The way it seems to work in France is the regular 95 octane is 10% ethanol and 98 is 5% ethanol. My bikes do not like 10% ethanol and absolutely hates the stuff with 15% ethanol.
As far as I can see the addition of ethanol reduces mileage so effectively you are 'burning' the ethanol for nothing and if petrol has 10% ethanol you simply burn 10% more of the stuff. Then factor in all the problems the ethanol causes..... What a scam.
As far as I can see the addition of ethanol reduces mileage so effectively you are 'burning' the ethanol for nothing and if petrol has 10% ethanol you simply burn 10% more of the stuff. Then factor in all the problems the ethanol causes..... What a scam.
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Re: Petrol: supermarket vs shell etc
Used to work for Esso in Distribution so I have some knowledge here.
Not very many refineries in the UK now, biggest one in the South is Fawley, Southampton. Shell has a big one in the North West. Crude is distilled there and fed by pipe to various terminals and airports in the South, including military locations. Different grades travel in batches, with the inter phase being siphoned off and tanked back to the refinery.
At the Distribution depot, different grades are kept in big tanks (Unleaded, Super, Diesel, Kerosene, etc.)
Different oil companies use each others facilities...it just makes sense. When a Shell tank pulls up, he will enter his code and the the terminal gantry system will recognize the order volume and add Shell additives to the base Unleaded liquid. BP tank turns up...same thing...but adds the BP additives. Tesco driver turns up....you are just getting base unleaded (unless its that Tesco 100 when additives are injected). Additives are Company specific, proprietary in nature and are not all the same.
Normal road tanker has 5 pots, can carry about 40,000 litres.
Not very many refineries in the UK now, biggest one in the South is Fawley, Southampton. Shell has a big one in the North West. Crude is distilled there and fed by pipe to various terminals and airports in the South, including military locations. Different grades travel in batches, with the inter phase being siphoned off and tanked back to the refinery.
At the Distribution depot, different grades are kept in big tanks (Unleaded, Super, Diesel, Kerosene, etc.)
Different oil companies use each others facilities...it just makes sense. When a Shell tank pulls up, he will enter his code and the the terminal gantry system will recognize the order volume and add Shell additives to the base Unleaded liquid. BP tank turns up...same thing...but adds the BP additives. Tesco driver turns up....you are just getting base unleaded (unless its that Tesco 100 when additives are injected). Additives are Company specific, proprietary in nature and are not all the same.
Normal road tanker has 5 pots, can carry about 40,000 litres.
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Re: Petrol: supermarket vs shell etc
Good info. Thanks.Geecee68 wrote: ↑Thu Jan 09, 2020 1:45 pm Used to work for Esso in Distribution so I have some knowledge here.
Not very many refineries in the UK now, biggest one in the South is Fawley, Southampton. Shell has a big one in the North West. Crude is distilled there and fed by pipe to various terminals and airports in the South, including military locations. Different grades travel in batches, with the inter phase being siphoned off and tanked back to the refinery.
At the Distribution depot, different grades are kept in big tanks (Unleaded, Super, Diesel, Kerosene, etc.)
Different oil companies use each others facilities...it just makes sense. When a Shell tank pulls up, he will enter his code and the the terminal gantry system will recognize the order volume and add Shell additives to the base Unleaded liquid. BP tank turns up...same thing...but adds the BP additives. Tesco driver turns up....you are just getting base unleaded (unless its that Tesco 100 when additives are injected). Additives are Company specific, proprietary in nature and are not all the same.
Normal road tanker has 5 pots, can carry about 40,000 litres.
Am I right in believing the story that the ethanol is only added at the last minute or are you including that in the ‘additives’ anyway?
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